Board Thread:Character Discussion/@comment-28398720-20160530203022/@comment-28151443-20170130174047

- If Bellamy was a traitor in some moment of the past why did people trust and follow him on the ground? We saw how sky people dealt with Finn(S2) and Octavia(S1 and S3), when did we see the same hatred against Bellamy?

The real problem with this interpretation of events is that Aurora hadn’t chance to sacrifice herself because the guards caught her children first. They hadn’t any information about Octavia but knew Bellamy who protected strange girl very well. And when they started to ask questions as “Why hasn’t this girl documents?” and “Why does cadet Blake protect her?”, the things would come to their places very fast and the first place the guards would check is the Blake’s home. Then Aurora’s charisma wouldn’t be enough to distracted them from the hole under the floor anymore. Bellamy was mature and was a guard(which make the things worse for him). It’s not like he never saw Octavia before or he didn’t know that she was under the floor all the time. From the moment when he became 18 years old man, he kept Octavia’s exist and Aurora Blake’s crime hidden from Ark’s government and that is a treason.

- Ok, if you’re right why was Bellamy so big threat for Shumway on the Earth but when he was on the Ark – Jaha wouldn’t believe him? What was the thing Bellamy had on the Earth which he hadn’t on the Ark? (No, “Clarke” isn’t the right answer).

Raven spied Abby and Jackson because people saw the dropship. She was suspicious because something happened and she has to fight for someone she loved. As I wrote Bellamy was broken, he hadn’t any reason to fight because he didn’t except something to happen.

Jaha accepted Diana because of people who liked her, this is different from trust. It wasn’t Kane and Abby who opened his eyes, they were together in this – Kane who knew that this was attack against Ark’s government, Jaha who asked where is Diana and Abby who noticed that Diana was leaving too early. Jaha sentence Jake to death and arrested Clarke because their actions could make a riot on the Ark and would risk lives of everyone else but he pardoned Abby although Ark’s laws. In the situation when someone threatens their lives, it’s his duty to understand who wants his life and position. Bellamy hadn’t power to save Octavia, but he had information that could do it. If someone want to kill you, wouldn’t you want to understand who is it?

- I would rather if they educated them and didn’t keep them lock all the time. They are just teenagers at the end of the day. It’s not enough that they are still alive if they didn’t know anything about the life on the Ark. The Sky box is like holiday far away from the real world and their responsibilities which is perfect place for reckless children who didn’t care for laws or didn’t know what to do with their future.

- Yes, it was about domination and control. But no one knew about his order instead he, Atom and Octavia. No one saw Octavia and Atom while they kissed. Bellamy returned in the camp after he failed cutting Clarke’s hand earlier and saw how Octavia could find new life here and he was jealous. He could talk with Atom(because Atom was the only one who truly understood and respected Bellamy in that moment) as a real brother would did. But Bellamy chose to make big deal from a kiss, to humiliate both – Octavia and Atom in front his puppets because of it and gave people material for jokes about them. He knew that people didn’t accepted Octavia but instead he made things easier for her, Bellamy gave people another reason to stay away from her and did everything possible to scare one of the people she liked there.

* They talked privately before Clarke provoked Murphy in front of all people in the camp and Bellamy didn’t want to investigate Wells’s death. Lying people was more important for him than their safety, grounders wasn’t a threat for them then – the delinquents were. Do you realize that keeping people afraid of grounders is one of the reason why they couldn’t achieve peace now?

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- Excuse me, <span style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin">apparently <span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif";mso-ascii-theme-font: major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language:EN-US">, it’s just me who truly find the sentence “Bellamy trusted Murphy” for ridiculous. To find their friends was the reason why they risked their lives in grounders territory. The grounder who Finn killed gave them the map and tell them where they could find their people. And the all Finn’s actions we talked about are all proves why Bellamy shouldn’t let him to go there. But he didn’t even try to stop him or to find another way. They were in this together but Bellamy took his sister with him when he returned in Arkadia and left two people who he didn’t like to their fate.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">* Actually in the next episode(2x05) that were Octavia’s words –  “ <span style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin">Finn and Murphy are headed for Lincoln's village. <span style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US"> <span style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin">I've been there. <span style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif";mso-ascii-theme-font: major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language:EN-US"> <span style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif";mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin; mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin">Have you? <span style="font-family: "CalibriLight","sans-serif";mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font: major-latin;mso-ansi-language:EN-US"> <span style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin">Has she? <span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif";mso-ascii-theme-font: major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language:EN-US">”. The matter of other discussion is why didn’t Octavia tell them that delinquents weren’t in the village she came from.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- Apparently is just me(again) who would never go to free strange people before be 100% sure that my people are fine and safe with me before it. Because: 1. The door in the room where grounders were could be locked; 2. The lift in the room was their exit; 3. 40 people who have some real weapons could make blockade in the room, keep MM away from it(if it’s need) and free grounders faster than 1; 4. The grounders army was totally useless when they didn’t want to kill people in MW. This just would kill more people than they wanted to save. The MM didn’t know that they were safe and would start to fight with them; 5. To distracted MM from prisoners they could use fire, or radiation or flood. They could break the weapons or make a bomb. It wasn’t needed to risk Wick, Raven and grounders lives for nothing.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">Yes, grounders are great fighters, no one double it but while SP have their weapons they always would be a losers. And when Bellamy left grounders, MM had theirs. I think you overrated grounders’ abilities to protect yourselves against guns.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- Who is double it? But he failed. To save only your people when has a different goal isn’t a win. They had no choice is excuse for their crime against humanity. Lexa abounded them but Dante and MM change the situation for her. What kind of leader she would be if MM killed her people while she is loyal to sky people?

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">If you noticed the grounders left the MW immediately after the door were opened. I think that we could agree – grounders couldn’t find the right way alone so someone should help them. But who? What would warriors find in the MW if Lexa was loyal to Sky people? This wasn’t(was and wasn’t in the same time) a good decision if you ask me. Lexa was in very shitty situation and I believe if it wasn’t all fans who loved her she would die because of the choice she made. This was the biggest army the grounders ever have and the first time when they were so close to their the greatest enemy. With SP’s help they would win for first and last time in their history which would end the all terror they lived in because of them – "Blood must have blood”. It hadn’t matter how many people Lexa saved with her decision, the killed always will be more.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">Bellamy and Clarke put the responsibility for MM’s lives in Cage’s hands but with him in charge they wouldn’t stop killings. It wasn’t his or Dante’s decision to stop killings after their people agreed with their plan. Dante lost all moral right to judge people when Cage gave him the cure. Cage turned his people against delinquents telling them the truth; Clarke and Bellamy could did the same thing from the same room Cage did it. It isn’t Lexa who killed MM, Bellamy and Clarke chose to do it. Lexa maybe abounded her allies but Bellamy and Clarke killed theirs.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">It’s a luck that keep sky people alive. There isn’t anything in common with Clarke and Bellamy’s abilities as leaders(which are totally missing if you ask me). They haven’t any tactics. Bellamy gave/let weapons to wrong people – and didn’t stop after Jasper destroyed their chance for peace because he was drunk; or Finn who was lost his mind; or Pike whose idea from beginning was “Let we kill the army”(in which universe any of this is good idea?). Their plan to protect Finn included dropship where they were 5 people against whole grounders army who hatred them. How fast their bullets would be run out? How easily could grounders catch them after it? Why didn’t Clarke use the fact that they were the only one who knew how to stop MM for 56 years and could return kidnapped grounders and stop MM crimes against Lexa’s people?(There isn’t any leader who would refused to destroyed the greatest enemy of its people because of 18 killed because of mistake in military mission). But instead of it, Clarke told Lexa whole truth about situation with MM and left life of her people in hands of girl who she knew since 5 minutes without plan B. Was it a good strategy?

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- I don’t know what kind of conversation you expect from “The 100” when they put in the bed the most curious characters in the show without show us any conversations between them about their totally different cultures but you missed some lines between starting of conversation and hitting. As missed to appreciate the fact that Octavia never hit Indra really(Why do people say it when it isn’t truth actually?).

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">*It’s <span style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin">302 <span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif";mso-ascii-theme-font: major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language:EN-US">grounders that Bellamy killed in S3 actually while he was on Pike’s side. But I don’t think that one or two more or less would make his situation better. “300” is lovely number and I guess writers love the movie.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- He hadn’t friends. Maybe Octavia’s this best friend for him – the only one he had and they had the fun together. He had fun with Octavia. Bellamy had an awful life but he found a way to love it. Do you know how hard this is actually?

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- Really? He made a speech for Kane when he was sentence before Pike sentence Lincoln and Sinclair to death too. There was a speech for Sinclair after Pike order him to haunt their people to can stop Kane’s riot but there wasn’t literally nothing for Lincoln. And I’m very curious what was thinking Bellamy that would happen with prisoners after they were arrested? Pike refused to give them medicines. The Chancellor from the very beginning said that they couldn’t leave them to go outside Arkadia because they knew the camp very well and grounders could use that information to attacked them. What would happen with them when sky people’s resources were done? What would happen with them as grounders when before five minutes Pike and his people go to haunt grounders?

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">How far Pike wouldn’t go according to Bellamy when the first thing he did after became a Chancellor was act of war and had 300 dead? Where is too far according to Bellamy? What will Bellamy do to fix mistake he did is S3? Is it mistake to kill 300 people when you know that they aren’t there to hurt you; that your actions can lead to war which couldn’t be won; that everyone who you love want peace and your action will ruin that? Or is it just stubborn, infantile desire to prove your uprightness over people?

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- Everything is matter of the right moment. I’ll return to the case with Jake Griffin. The information he had would make a riot when he find it because most people hate the Ark, government, guards, the whole system which smash them and their families all the time. But a year later when Abby warned people they sacrificed their lives and saved their people. Did they start like the Ark more than before? I don’t think so. The Ark was the same hatred place just their families were in danger and they couldn’t do anything to stop it. It wasn’t Jake who inspire people but the death which scared them.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">In S1 they had chance to achieved peace but someone gave deadly weapon to drunk kid with PTSD and took it with them. What would you think if you go to peace negotiations and someone start shot against you? What would you do after it? Lexa tried to achieve peace in S3 and failed because it wasn’t enough that Clarke wanted peace when her people didn’t. Clarke spared Emerson’s life wanting to show people that peace between all of them is possible but that wasn’t enough, was it? The problem is that it wasn’t she who has to “forgive”(it isn’t the right word, I know) him for MW. He should do it. Clarke killed all his people but Emerson paid the price for her crime while she acted like she is the only victim there. <span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-bidi-font-family: Arial;color:#DD4B39;background:white;mso-ansi-language:EN-US"> 

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- Yeah, it’s hard for her to be accepted by them when her people killed theirs. The grounder who don’t like her just don’t know her yet. When Lincoln died, she feels like she shouldn’t be part of them as she didn’t wanted to live with Luna anymore or sky people. But if she wanted it she would have all of it, don’t double it. <span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-bidi-font-family: Arial;color:#DD4B39;background:white;mso-ansi-language:EN-US"> 

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-bidi-font-family: Arial;background:white;mso-ansi-language:EN-US;mso-bidi-font-weight:bold">- W <span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif";mso-ascii-theme-font: major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language:EN-US">hat was the point of alliance then if grounders wasn’t Bellamy’s people or sky people wasn’t Lexa’s one? To be part of something like it has its authority and responsibilities. I didn’t understand why in S2 sky people didn’t forced Lexa to make them part of it. They killed Finn because of her people, they gave her their knowledge to save grounders who were locked in MW and the only thing they wanted from her in return was her useless army. Seriously? I guess this is one of Bellamy and Clarke’s genius tactics, isn't it? The Lexa’s coalition is the greatest difference between situations in S2 and S3. In S2 sky people were no one, grounders didn’t like or respect them; in S3 the things were different because of Lexa who admitted them as equal with grounders. The grounders maybe didn’t want, like or accept Sky people but they won’t do anything against them because the coalition protect peace among 12 clans and more of them appreciate it. Bellamy love history, he should know the differences and the importance of coalitions. <span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-bidi-font-family: Arial;color:#DD4B39;background:white;mso-ansi-language:EN-US"> 

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">That the Ice nation betrayed Lexa and sky people don’t mean that all grounders deserved death. What would happen if grounders were killed Octavia or Clarke because of Bellamy’s actions? Maybe he would understood their actions then?

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">I couldn’t understand why did everyone repeat Echo like she is the most important person in his life? How long he knew her? What were the things he knew about her? Was he fell in love with her? Do you realize that Bellamy actions against his family was inspired by a stranger? He knew nothing about Echo before or after she betrayed him. The only reason he had trust in her was the fact that she was a girl in a trouble in MW. And we all know how much he love people in trouble. You said that he wasn’t lost his trust in his people but was it what his actions actually showed to us?

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">It’s not need for me to trust or like grounders when my people haven’t enough resources to lead a war against them. To make people believe that they could win war where the plan is “kill every grounder who move” is much more than just reckless. We all know that after their bullets run out, they would die.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- While I’m watching how Bellamy and Clarke repeat their mistakes over and over again, how neglect other people’s pain and act like they are the only one who really suffer, I think that forgiveness is a lot easy for them.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">For me the result determined character’s actions as wrong and right in these post-apocalyptic worlds and not only. Bellamy wanted to protect his people which is a good thing and killed the enemies but all he got at the end was hatred and blockade for them. When Octavia hit Lincoln which is bad thing, she was despaired and I’m sure that the last thing she thought about when she did it was that he would come with her after it but he really did it. Kane spared Bellamy’s life which was very honorable act(when we remember who he was in S1) but because he did it, the riot failed, Lincoln and Sinclair died, the Arkadia fell and the grounders’ capital was destroyed. Lexa fought for peace another lovely action but while she did it, her people were left alone while sky people killed them and stole their lands. Her peaceful actions didn’t end with peace. But MM’s violence actions gave them peaceful lovely life for 56 years which isn’t so bad when you are far away from battle field and death, is it?

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- No one there know how to handle with their emotions because since 93 years there hadn’t people who were in their situation? No one prepare them or their parents for war and damage of it.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- For me these situations are the same in their base – sky people who killed innocent grounders because of their own people. I don’t know where came Finn’s PTSD but in the village and before that he was much more reasonable than he was before when expecting from Clarke to don’t take a weapons to their meeting with grounders because “You shouldn’t trust them, you should trust me.”(And what do you know about them, my love?) for example. He had a plan which didn’t included someone to be hurt. Because he was leaving, knowing that he was made a mistake – his people wasn’t there. People in the village died because he lost control over situation. But in S3 people died because Bellamy had control over situation.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">- Yes, they are and if you watch the shows will know that they are less malicious than the main protagonists in The 100. I’m just saying that when it comes to leadership tactics, logic in their action as people and role of heroes in their own stories, these both villains are better created than some of The 100’s characters.

<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"CalibriLight","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-theme-font:major-latin;mso-hansi-theme-font:major-latin;mso-ansi-language: EN-US">I thought these are just shades of their characters that I don’t like. There aren’t anything in common with my abilities to understand, like and adore all of them or their actions(without Bellamy, Clarke and Lexa). I love post-apocalyptic worlds. The plot was the first reason why I fell in love in it at the first time. The idea that people who could survived their own tries to kill each other and start again. The post-apocalyptic Earth. The Ark. Grounders. MM. A.L.I.E. In the show has very interest moral dilemmas. But the first thing that comes to my mind now is dynamic. There is a great dynamic which is missing in many better shows that The 100 if we should be honest.